#111 Preparing for Your Horse’s Nutritional Needs during Winter with Connie Flores

[SPEAKER 1]
[00:00:02-00:00:09]
In this episode, we're talking with Connie Flores, certified equine nutrition advisor and founder of the Forage Porridge.

[SPEAKER 2]
[00:00:10-00:00:48]
Now, I would say knowing your horse is really important too, knowing their eating behaviors. Again, eating is a behavior, not just something that they do inherently. So we have to make sure that they're comfortable enough to eat. If they're just sitting in the corner shivering, making sure that your horse is safe enough to eat is really important for them. And what I mean by that is if they're being pushed off of hay piles, if you don't have sufficient hay stations for your herd, there's usually going to be an odd horse out that may not have sufficient access to those calories, even if it's free fed hay. So keep that in mind too. Be aware of your herd and maintain good herd management strategies for your own horses.

[SPEAKER 1]
[00:00:49-00:02:12]
Welcome to the Equestrian Connection podcast from WeHorse. My name is Danielle Kroll and I'm your host. Connie Flores is an independent equine nutrition consultant and the owner of 17 Hand Equine Nutrition. She lives in Denver, Colorado and consults in person across the front range of Colorado and has virtual clients all over the country. Connie specializes in herd keepers, horses with digestive issues, competition horses, and metabolic equines. Using a no-nonsense scientific-based approach, she loves to optimize the diet of horses for their health and longevity while supporting owners as they learn how to advocate for their horses. species-specific needs. Connie works independently of any feed company and provides unbiased feedback and recommendations, as well as keeps the owner's goals in mind. And if you may remember, Connie was a guest with us back on episode number 56, and I'm so excited to speak with her again. In this episode, we'll be discussing winter prep and our horse's nutritional needs during cold weather. To change or not to change their diet when exercise levels change and more. So here we go. Connie, welcome back to the WeHorse podcast. It feels like forever ago that we chatted, but also yesterday. So welcome back. I'm super excited to chat with you again.

[SPEAKER 2]
[00:02:12-00:02:16]
Thank you so much for having me again. It's good to hear from you. Good to talk.

[SPEAKER 1]
[00:02:16-00:02:51]
Yeah. All right. So last time, episode 56, for those listening, if you want to go back and start there, we did chat about... Excuse me, nutritional basics, and then more of your background in nutritional consulting in our first interview. And so let's do a quick little recap before we dive into today's topic around winter nutrition preparation and the do's and the don'ts. Can you just remind us what does being independent from feed companies change about the nutrition advice that you give?

[SPEAKER 2]
[00:02:51-00:03:50]
Yeah, so I am an independent equine nutrition consultant, which means that I can work with any of the feed companies that a client has available to them. None of the ones I don't want to work with. It also means that we can cater specifically to the horse in front of us and feed the horse, not based upon a specific brand, but based upon the best balance of products or forages or whatever ingredient we may need for that specific horse. So it really just helps guide us to feed the horse and not focus on feeding a brand due to loyalty, which also opens up a lot of different opportunities for being variable with the products at hand too. So I don't sell any products myself. And it's really nice to be able to work with high quality products specifically for that horse and what that owner can actually receive and sustainably feed their horse.

[SPEAKER 1]
[00:03:50-00:03:55]
Love it. Has anything changed for you since the last time we spoke? That you want to update us on?

[SPEAKER 2]
[00:03:57-00:04:34]
A lot. I've been through two additional programs with my mentor, doing more advanced nutrition things. And I, this past year in June, just finished up our third critical research review. So now I'm in her advanced level of equine nutrition advisors. And we really dived into reading research, understanding what good research is, understanding what bad research is, and how to convert what we know about that research paper into layman's terms for our clients and really make sure that We're supporting our clients with science leading the way as best as possible.

[SPEAKER 1]
[00:04:35-00:04:39]
That's awesome. Congratulations on completing all of that. Cause like, thank you. It sounds like a lot.

[SPEAKER 2]
[00:04:39-00:04:47]
Thank you. I did my own little mock research proposal and that was a lot of work, but it was fun.

[SPEAKER 1]
[00:04:47-00:05:40]
Yeah, good, good. Okay, we are now in October. And this is the thing that I'm really excited about. When I saw it on social media that you were talking about it, I thought, oh, I am not only interested for my own horses, but I think it's just a really important topic that many of us aren't really aware of. We stick to the status quo, you know, feeding what has worked maybe in the three other seasons and then kind of wonder why when we take the blanket off our horses in the winter, they might be looking a little bit different. So that's what we're going to chat about today. So many of us in the Northern Hemisphere, ourselves included, are preparing for winter. First of all, like, should we be even adjusting feed for the winter? And if so, at what point should owners start making those feed adjustments now or later?

[SPEAKER 2]
[00:05:41-00:07:29]
So it definitely depends upon your goals and the horse that you have. So for example, if you have a hard keeper and you know that they tend to lose winter in colder months, you need to start in September for upping their condition a little bit over ideal. So that way they have a little cushion to lose a little bit of weight and still look. good. The next best time to start right now. So making sure that you're increasing their body condition just a little bit, I would say that, and for a reminder, with the body condition scoring system, we use a Hanneke body condition scoring chart, which goes from one to nine with one being emaciated, nine being morbidly obese. And ideal lands between a five and a six, depending upon the horse and depending upon your goals. So if you're, for example, if you have a thoroughbred that is usually a five, but you know, they tend to drop down to a four during the winter, I would actually aim to get them to at a five and a half, if you can do a little half extra, just to be over a little bit. So there's a little bit more wiggle room for them to lose. Now, with our easy keepers, winter can actually be to our advantage. And I don't mean make them shiver to lose weight, but I do mean you can use winter as a way to have them expel excess energy, excess adipose tissue transformed into energy during that time period. So maybe blanket your easy keeper slightly later or, you know. Think about maybe not increasing their hay dramatically in the first few winter months to help them lose weight a little bit before those cold snaps happen. So depending upon the horse at hand, you need to address it differently. Okay, so

[SPEAKER 1]
[00:07:30-00:08:12]
That's kind of like a little bit more of like the body type of the horse. But what also about their workload? So let's say, you know, it's an easy keeper, but they don't do anything in the winter or it's a herd keeper and they have the winter off or, you know, or something like that. You know, because there are many people that, you know, are able to ride all year round and have. An indoor arena or maybe they go down south for the winter. And then there's also a large amount of horse owners who slow down in the winter because they only have an outdoor ring, you know, or whatever the conditions are. So does that change how you make adjustments based on the workload as well?

[SPEAKER 2]
[00:08:12-00:10:26]
Yes. Now the NRC has different requirements for workload as per horse weight as well. So as you go up in workload, you go up in nutritional demands, especially energy, digestible energy, which is calories. Now, as you come back down out of workload, you don't need quite as many calories to maintain condition, especially with an easy keeper. So For example, if you have like a really easy keeping quarter horse and you've been feeding them like a performance feed as they're in hard work, like maybe they do ranch work or reining or dressage, whatever it may be. And you're like having a tough season where you've got to keep more weight on them, but they're generally an easier keeper. If they pull out of work, you need to cut that back. Cut back that hard feed because that will be detrimental for them gaining too much weight. And same thing, I would say for a hard keeper, like our thinner horses, you may not need to decrease feed as much, but make sure you maximize forage first, always for blanket statement for all horses, make sure you've maximized forage as much as you can first. And if you are feeding a higher calorie, higher fat feed, and you're noticing that they're getting a little fizzy, a little more energy in the winter because they have it off, you can decrease that and maybe balance that out with a little bit of balancer. And this comes to a lot of nuance with your horse at hand. So it depends upon the products that you're feeding, but I would make sure that you maximize forage first and then don't overfeed your concentrates. Make sure that your horse is maintaining weight well and that you're actually meeting their vitamins and minerals amounts based upon the feed rate on the tag on the back, or you're mixing in a lower feeding rate product. And maybe you just need a couple pounds of alfalfa pellets or beet pulp on top of that. It depends upon that horse. So long story short, yes, if you are decreasing workload, make sure you're maintaining a good quality amount of forage in the diet. And then consider cutting back on the grain or concentrates that you're feeding to make sure you're not contributing to an overweight issue for your horses, depending upon how that horse metabolizes energy.

[SPEAKER 1]
[00:10:27-00:10:42]
Yeah, it's so interesting because I mean, like, every single question, it will be like, well, it depends on the horse, you know, which is why it's so important to book a consultation to discuss, you know, your horse's specific needs.

[SPEAKER 2]
[00:10:43-00:10:44]
Yes, exactly.

[SPEAKER 1]
[00:10:45-00:11:06]
One other thing with that. So that was kind of like horses that maybe still are in work and some that aren't in work. What about the horses that live in versus the horses that live out? So if they're, let's say, stalled partially throughout the winter at nights or something like that versus the horses that... Are only in a shelter or, you know, living out a little bit more in the elements.

[SPEAKER 2]
[00:11:06-00:12:30]
With each of those scenarios, you have to think about what the lower critical temperature is going to be for that horse in their living environment. Now, if you have a horse that is stalled, they're typically coming into a warmer barn, even if it's not heated, the body heat of the horses in the enclosed space will warm it up enough to maybe they don't even need a blanket overnight, depending upon where you are and how you're set up. But if you have a horse that's outside, making sure that they have access to appropriate shelters is very important and that they have the choice. Pasture boarder horses should always be able to choose shelter should they wish it. Now we all know some horses that would rather die than sit inside of a shelter. So then knowing your horse is very important too. If you have a horse that would rather sit out in the rain, but they're a thinner inclined horse, a little bit of a harder keep. If they're going to get wet and cold, that's a danger for them. So make sure that they're blanketed appropriately, even if they're not choosing to use the shelter. And some horses, you know, some really woolly mammoths out there might have the best winter coat ever and not need to be blanketed at all. And they're totally fine with abundant forage and shelter. At least there's some sort of windbreak. The most important thing is to not let a horse become wet and cold because that will really decrease their ability to thermoregulate.

[SPEAKER 1]
[00:12:30-00:12:54]
You mentioned earlier about maximizing the forage consumption. Is there sort of a measurement to know how much forage to increase, like how much hay to increase a horse, you know, to give a horse? Or is it kind of just like... 24-7, you know, or like access. What do you recommend for that?

[SPEAKER 2]
[00:12:55-00:17:07]
I'm going to tell you a story. It depends. I'm going to tell you my favorite line. Sorry. But it really does depend. So on average, a 500 kilogram horse will need about 2% of their body weight per day in feed and forage. So that's usually around 10 kilograms of forage or 22 pounds for our American listeners. And for American listeners that didn't catch, a 500-kilogram horse is 1,100 pounds. So that may increase by 30 to 50%. 50% when you have very cold temperatures. If you've got a hard keeper, I would say give them free bar, give them an open access bar to hay as much as possible, especially if they're, if they're outside, especially if they're living outside, because the way horses maintain heat is not only a good winter coat, but also the fermentation process of those microbiota in the hindgut create volatile fatty acids that increases heat for the horses. So the best way to warm up your horse is to feed them extra hay. Now, there is something called the lower critical temperature, which is the temperature below which metabolic heat production is increased to maintain a core body temperature. For each decrease in coldness of one degree Fahrenheit below the critical temperature, there is an increase in 1% digestible energy requirements for body temperature maintenance. What do I mean by that? So for the average healthy horse with a really good winter coat, around 18 degrees Fahrenheit, which is around negative eight degrees Celsius, that's usually the point where they reach the lower critical temperature and they start struggling a little bit. So it could be as low as five degrees Fahrenheit, which is negative 15 degrees Celsius. So at that point in time, if we're having overnight temperatures that are down below 20 degrees or in the teens Fahrenheit, then we need to consider adding in additional forage to increase the amount of calories they have accessible to them as they're burning more calories to maintain their body temperature. So again, that could be an increase of 30 to 50% of additional need of hay. So when you think about that, like, okay, so I need 50% more hay than I normally throw out. If you normally put out that 2% for 500 kilogram horse, which is 10 kilograms, and you need another five kilograms to help them maintain their body temperature. So keep that in mind too, is that you do need to increase the amount of forage if it's very, very cold. So that's like the average, like standardized research process. Now I would say knowing your horse is really important too, knowing their eating behaviors. Again, eating is a behavior, not just something that they do inherently. So we have to make sure that they're comfortable enough to eat. If they're just sitting in the corner shivering, making sure that your horse is safe enough to eat is really important for them. And what I mean by that is if they're being pushed off of hay piles, if you don't have sufficient hay stations for your herd, there's usually going to be an odd horse out that may not have sufficient access to those calories, even if it's free fed hay. So keep that in mind too. Be aware of your herd and maintain good herd management strategies for your own horses. And I would say for a heart keeper, just let them have as much hay as they want when it's really cold. That being said, this is a hard season. You were mentioning earlier, I did do a talk about how to use the hay that you have this winter because a lot of North American content is going through a major drought. So just throwing out hay might not be sustainable or affordable for many horse owners this season. So what we need to do is utilize ways to contain the hay. Even if you're not trying to slow your horse down, making sure that your hay isn't being wasted is really important.

[SPEAKER 1]
[00:17:08-00:17:28]
Yeah. Yeah. My local area went through a drought last year and, um, I am very, very glad that we have been blessed with, you know, a decent rainfall this summer because it just felt like everybody was fighting for, you know, whatever hay that they could get.

[SPEAKER 2]
[00:17:29-00:17:57]
Yeah, absolutely. And it does become a point where you use the hay that you have. And there's different strategies for that. Even if it's low protein or high sugars and starches, you can figure out a way to make it work for your herd. But making sure that we're not letting the hay just blow away into the oblivion is really important. I will note that if you're in a very cold place, sometimes hay nets freeze and horses won't want to eat the hay that's beyond that frozen layer.

[SPEAKER 1]
[00:17:57-00:17:58]
Yeah, yeah.

[SPEAKER 2]
[00:17:58-00:18:35]
Yeah. Sometimes just having a hay containment system like a hay ring or a hay hut or something like that could be more beneficial for your horses than necessarily hay netting, depending upon your environment. Even if you do have super easy keepers, because if they can't access hay, they still need to, they still need to eat it. So making sure that your horses can actually eat whatever system you're utilizing is very important. And there's so many different options on the market that if people wanted some ideas, they can message me. There's plenty of things out there, but keep in mind your environment, your horse's needs, and are they actually eating the hay that's being provided?

[SPEAKER 1]
[00:18:37-00:20:12]
Yeah, one other thing I want to add to that is I noticed specifically this past winter, which was very cold in my area. I have always fed extra hay during the winter, especially on the nights. I'm like, oh, the temperature is going to get down really low. I'll give them, you know, a little bit of extra hay tonight. And we have a few different hay boxes that they can like move around and choose from and stuff like that. And then they also can go up and go into the barn free choice should they choose to for shelter. And there were some nights that I knew it was going to be really cold. And when I would go out in the morning, I would look and they had only eaten, you know, half of the hay that I put out. And I would think to myself, like, geez. Shouldn't you be eating more? for, you know, to keep warm and things like that. And I realized that during those really cold nights, they almost had to choose, do we go up into the shelter or do we stay down in the open area of the hay boxes? And that was a really important thing to be mindful of as well is the location of where you're putting that hay. You can think I'm giving my horses free choice hay, like they can go down and choose to eat. But if it's cold and windy and it's in an open area, the horses may choose to go up into an area to be less exposed. And then it's like, do I go to less wind or do I go to more food? So that was an important thing for me to kind of realize.

[SPEAKER 2]
[00:20:12-00:20:59]
Yeah, I love that you were able to have that identification within your own herd, because if you are putting out a shelter, I think that it's a really good consideration to make sure that the shelter has some hay, if possible. Especially with we have like a blizzard coming through or something like that. Like, do you want to go outside and drink your hot chocolate on the patio if there's a blizzard happening? I don't think so. Absolutely. For a little metaphor there. So making sure that your horse has abundant hay stations, should they decide to, you know, beyond the veranda, or making sure that they can stay cozy and stay eating, especially if you've had a horse that has had previous digestive issues before, making sure that they have free access to hay is really important when it comes to

[SPEAKER 1]
[00:21:00-00:22:31]
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[SPEAKER 3]
[00:22:30-00:22:35]
Should we be warming it up a little bit more? Should they get more salt or electrolytes? All the things.

[SPEAKER 2]
[00:22:36-00:25:38]
Okay, so let's talk about that. Now, with water, they do know with research that horses prefer to drink water at 50 to 65 degrees Fahrenheit. And if it's colder than that, they might not drink enough. So not only are we checking, okay, is there ice in this, but are they actually drinking that water? And that's also why we see an increased risk of impaction colics in the wintertime is because horses may not be choosing to drink enough water. So making sure that you give them, even if you bring like a thermos of hot water with you to the barn and top it off in their bucket, that could increase the temperature enough to make your horse drink. That's a consideration to make. I think that depending upon your bucket system too, there's some people that set up heated buckets if possible, if there is electric. Some people like to bring in one of those electric kettles to their barns. I mean, I hope everybody has electricity. So even if you don't have hot water, using an electric kettle can be a really quick way to quickly boil some water and top off your horse's buckets with it to just kind of bring it up to moderately lukewarm of some kind, just not freezing, right? Some people like to have pile, I don't know if you've seen this before, where they take manure and they like wrap it around a tub. and then like wrap that with straw to have the manure be like a heat generator for the water bucket. I don't know. I've seen that before. So there's lots of different options for increasing your horse's water temperature. Again, that 50 to 65 degree Fahrenheit is ideal for horses. It's not always attainable, but making sure that they don't have to drink incredibly ice cold water can be one of the best things you do as soon as you get to the barn to ensure they have at least at least five gallons of some moderately lukewarm water. And horses, on average, will drink five to 10 gallons of water a day, sometimes more, depending upon the pony. So make that, I think that would be a really nice winter tradition is, oh, let me bring some warm water for my horse, or let me bring my electric kettle with me and just top off their buckets, if possible. And there's plenty of different ways to increase your horse's water consumption. Another consideration is auto waterers. You won't really know how much water your horse is drinking with an auto waterer, and they can have freezes in the pipes. Every auto waterer system I've seen is a little different. But making sure that it's working is really important. So always check that. Some have the luxury of being heated too, which is delightful. And some of us just have buckets, wrap it with styrofoam, right? So do what you can in your circumstances, but making sure you're monitoring your horses drinking habits and making sure that you can actually observe them drinking is ideal to monitor how much they're actually consuming.

[SPEAKER 1]
[00:25:39-00:26:43]
I have a bit of a funny story. So here on my farm, we don't have heated water. And so in the winter, you know, we're filling up the water trough and everything like that. And normally in the evenings, we'll fill up two water buckets. We just bring them in the house. This is, you know, I'm sharing all of my little like... Horse girl like secrets that we tried in like they're it's like instagram versus reality this is the reality sloshing hot water on yourself bringing water buckets into the house and filling them up with hot water in the bathtub and then carrying them out and dumping them into the water trough so that the water is more like of a lukewarmish kind of a temperature just versus the freezing cold and so my husband one night i was like can you fill up the water buckets and bring them out to the horses and like just dump them in to you know again warm up their water so he's doing that and all of a sudden he comes in and he's soaking wet

[SPEAKER 2]
[00:26:44-00:26:44]
Oh, no.

[SPEAKER 1]
[00:26:44-00:26:52]
And he was like, there was some ice on the ground. The snow was over top of it. And I slipped. And the water went all over me.

[SPEAKER 2]
[00:26:52-00:26:53]
Oh, no.

[SPEAKER 1]
[00:26:53-00:27:13]
And I said, I was like, well, at least it was warm. Hilarious. It's the things we do for our horses, right? You know, like, so here we are every night bringing out, you know, two, four buckets of hot water to dump in just to kind of warm up that water temperature, things like that for them.

[SPEAKER 2]
[00:27:13-00:27:14]
Hey, good on you.

[SPEAKER 1]
[00:27:14-00:27:18]
So, yeah, it's pretty funny, some of the things that we do, but it's because we love them.

[SPEAKER 2]
[00:27:19-00:27:39]
Exactly. And one more thing with heated water. Some troughs will have those like little electric things that you plug in in the bottom. Make sure you touch the water and that it doesn't shock you. Because that can sometimes happen if there's a problem with it. So if you notice your horses are not drinking out of the heated bucket, go touch it yourself to make sure it's not zapping anybody.

[SPEAKER 1]
[00:27:40-00:27:49]
Very good point. Oh my goodness. What about electrolytes? We always hear about them being fed in the summer, and then you don't really hear about them the rest of the year.

[SPEAKER 2]
[00:27:49-00:30:35]
So I would say, and this is one thing I find a lot of people are surprised by, but I think you should be feeding your horse salt all year long. Salt is the cheapest supplement you'll buy. It's the one I find is efficient in most horse diets that I evaluate as well. Just any type of salt is fine. Sodium chloride is what they need to trigger the thirst response, and sodium and chloride are also the two major electrolytes that they sweat out. And what replaces that? Salt, which is sodium chloride. So I literally don't care what type of salt your horse eats. It can be fancy salt. It can be pink salt. It can be table salt. It can be Celtic. I don't care as long as it's a type of salt. salt that they will consume. There's also pelleted salt options now too. So there's a whole lot of different ways that horses can get salt in their diet. But rule of thumb is one tablespoon per 500 pounds weight per day. So for a 1100 pound horse, that's two tablespoons per day of salt. And you can add that to their feed daily and just have that be part of their diet. Now, some horses won't consume salt or will have a tolerance level. So you do need to introduce it slowly if you haven't done that before. And some horses will just go to town on a salt block and some won't touch it. So that's why knowing your horse is really important. My mare would never lick a salt block in her life. She just hated to do that. And I've known some horses that just will eat the rock in like three days. So a little overdoing it there. So for electrolyte purposes, I like to see daily salt in the diet year round. Salt will trigger the thirst response and actually have them go, oh, I'm thirsty. Let me go drink something. And I've seen this time and time again, even if you're already feeding electrolytes, adding plain salt can be a good way to trigger that thirst response. Again, we're trying to prevent impaction colic as much as we can. So having them have access to water temperature that is drinkable and having them on a daily salt intake of some kind. Those are two. Two good ways of insurances to help you prevent impaction colic. Two simple things you can do to prevent a lot of heartache. Um, With that, if you are still working during the wintertime, or if you have like a major storm coming through, or if your horse decides to go run in its blanket and sweat a lot, you could feed like an ounce of an electrolyte on top of that two tablespoons of salt per day to increase the amount to replenish what they've sweated out. And this, again, it varies per horse, but that's like an average recommendation, I would say.

[SPEAKER 1]
[00:30:36-00:31:02]
It's interesting. I've been feeding salt for quite a few years now, and I think I'm underfeeding it. My horses would only be getting like half a tablespoon twice a day, which, you know, so only one tablespoon. And they would need, specifically my mare especially, with her size, she would need two. So now I'm realizing I need to up my... Scoop for the salt. Give it a shot. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

[SPEAKER 2]
[00:31:03-00:31:17]
So, so generally, um, like, I think a tablespoon is like 15 grams of salt on rough average. So 15 grams per 500 pounds of a horse is a good recommendation.

[SPEAKER 1]
[00:31:18-00:31:18]
Okay.

[SPEAKER 2]
[00:31:18-00:31:34]
For the daily average. And that could increase if your horse is working really hard. Sometimes it could go up to three or four tablespoons per day if your horse is working harder. Or just... add on an electrolyte on top of that two tablespoons a day.

[SPEAKER 1]
[00:31:35-00:32:00]
Awesome. Good to know. I will up my scoop. You mentioned call. Like I want to talk a little bit about that as well. So why is it like, is it because of the water? Is it because of maybe reduced, like not eating as much forage if, if, you know, people are feeding less or not aware that they should be feeding more. Like, why is it that colic risk tends to rise in the winter?

[SPEAKER 2]
[00:32:00-00:33:08]
So I don't have numbers and specific statistics in front of me. I'm also not a veterinarian. So I just want to say that colic is a word that can indicate any sort of digestive distress in horses. There are hundreds of different types of colic. But when it comes to what I've seen, usually it's because the horse has reduced their water consumption in some way, which is a dehydration colic is usually one of the leading causes of impaction colic. And if that can correct me if I'm wrong, but that tends to be what happens in the wintertime. We tend to remove electrolytes. We tend to just say, okay, just drink your ice water. So there's some human elements there that could be contributing to an increased risk in an impaction colic in the wintertime. So being mindful of your horse, knowing... Who they are and their personalities and their eating habits is important. And one of the number one things you can do as a horse owner is if you know your horse, And you notice, oh, they didn't finish their meal today. Or, oh, I think they didn't drink their water today. That's a red flag that you need to pay attention to.

[SPEAKER 1]
[00:33:09-00:33:29]
Absolutely. Yeah, my gelding has colicked twice since I've owned him, but it's been in the summer. But I mean, it tells me a lot about what to do and not to do, specifically watching some of those things because it's been impaction colic both times. Interesting.

[SPEAKER 2]
[00:33:29-00:33:30]
I'm sorry to hear that.

[SPEAKER 1]
[00:33:30-00:34:05]
I mean, it's, he's made it through great both times. So, but yeah, it's definitely a concern for sure. Like you said, the impaction. So I have my little notes that I'm taking here mentally. Let's talk a little bit about seniors. So those elderly horses that may need a little bit more care in the winter, does winter feeding change for them more than, let's say, a horse that's, you know, in its quote, I'm using air quotes here, prime versus like a younger horse or anything like that?

[SPEAKER 2]
[00:34:05-00:37:07]
I think it really can, especially if the horse has any compounding factors such as PPID, previously known as Cushing's, or metabolic issues too. Because not every senior horse is going to look the same. And senior horses, they usually reach senior status when they have poor dentition, which means they can no longer chew long stem hay effectively. I've also seen some senior horses that can chew long stem hay just fine. but they no longer tend to utilize the nutrients from long stem hay as effectively as they used to. So with these senior horses, we're looking at, are they actually consuming forage? What forage type is going to be better for them to maintain a better body condition on? And do I need to increase their weight? Because sometimes you'll see, you know, older horses with like us, you know, they're atrophied through the back, through the top line, you can see their ribs. And those tend to be more of a risk factor going into winter. So we want to make sure that we're increasing their body condition as best we can before winter hits. I would also say that whenever you're talking about forage replacement, you need to do so with a transition plan in mind. For example, if you have a senior horse that can no longer eat hay anymore, you do need to replace their 2% body weight and feed forage. In a different form, whether that's chopped, cubed, pelleted, making sure that they're not going to choke on it by soaking it, making sure that they're actually going to consume it is important too. Or using a complete feed of some kind or mixing it all together. There's different ways you can build a diet for a senior horse to have them actually absorb the nutrients that they need from the forage by changing the forage form. And forage is forage is forage. The same nutrient content exists, whether it's long stem hay, which is your normal flakes of hay, whether it's chopped, pelleted, or cubed, the nutrient value will still remain there. I think that some people think whatever comes in a bag is a grain product, and that's not the case. There's plenty of forage products that are processed to be tinier pieces, which is more absorbable to many different horses that have digestive issues or are senior horses that just can't quite process those long stems as effectively as they used to. So for senior horses going into the wintertime, there's also a quality of life factor you need to consider. Like, is this horse actually doing poorly? Can they still get up from the ground? That's a conversation with your vet to have. You know, if they're still bright-eyed and still moving well, making sure that their body condition going into the winter is really important. But this is, unfortunately, a really hard time of year where horse owners with really old horses are making some really hard choices. And I do recognize that. But no matter what, we want to make sure that our horses have decent quality of life all the way through the end.

[SPEAKER 1]
[00:37:08-00:37:29]
What about warm mashes? Is that something that is helpful for any horse or seniors specifically? Or is it mostly for humans? Like I always add water to my feed all times of the year just to kind of make it a little bit more mushy for them. But in the winter, I tend to add warm water and I'm like, am I doing this for me or am I doing this for my horse?

[SPEAKER 2]
[00:37:31-00:39:11]
So I think the definition of mash needs to change because I actually really dislike seeing brand mashes being suddenly fed to horses. There's no point in changing your horse's diet suddenly. That's going to be a huge change for the microbiome in the back end, which will then shock them, which will then increase colic risk. What we want to do, I think adding some water to your feed can be a good idea if we're trying to increase water intake somewhat in some way and a tasty way too. So just adding water to your regular meals is totally acceptable. You can absolutely add warm water to it. If you're going for any sort of mash option, you can look at those. Those mashes that are on the market specifically for hydration purposes, there's some different companies that will have a hydration mash specifically. And that could be acceptable depending upon your horse and circumstances. But just simply adding water to their regular feed, even if it's a ration balancer, is totally acceptable. What I don't want to see is we're suddenly adding brand mash in the winter because we think it helps with colic. It does not. So please, please don't make sudden changes to your horse's diet. If we have like a cold front coming through, the thing I want you to do is make sure your horse has salt. Access to water, and increased hay. Those are the three top things I would say you can do if you have a winter storm coming in. And of course, making sure they have shelter and appropriate blanketing too. But put the brand meshes down, choose a more forage-based option or use the feed you already are feeding your horse.

[SPEAKER 1]
[00:39:12-00:39:36]
Okay, so like I said in the very beginning, and for those listening, obviously this is where it's now October 2nd. This is going to come out in a week or two, so it'll be mid-October when everybody's listening to this. If listeners could only do, let's say, like one to three things this week or up to three things this month to prepare for winter if they haven't done so already, what would you recommend they start doing?

[SPEAKER 2]
[00:39:36-00:40:57]
Make sure you assess your horse's body condition. I have a free body condition scoring guide on my website. You can download it as a PDF. Making sure you know if your horse is fit, fat, or thin is going to be incredibly important information for you as you move into winter. Know your horse's score. Know how much you have to feed them as things change. Next, I want to make sure that your horse is having adequate water intake. Know your horse's limits for their salt intake. Like if a tablespoon in a meal is too much, just do less. Some salt is better than no salt. So make sure that you've got some sort of salt or electrolyte program on hand to help increase that thirst response and monitor their water intake and make sure your water buckets are working for them. And then the third thing I would say, know your horse's eating habits. The number one thing you can do as a horse owner is know your horse and to say, oh, he's feeling a little off. Let me call the vet now before it becomes a bigger issue. Right. So if you notice your horse has stopped eating or is listless or inappetent, take their temperature, monitor their gut sounds, call your vet if you have any concerns to make sure that you're doing preventative care for your horse instead of proactive or reactive care.

[SPEAKER 1]
[00:40:58-00:41:23]
We're going to put, for those listening, we're going to put Connie's website link in the show notes. So if you heard her say about the body condition score free PDF and you want that, just scroll down in the show notes, click on the link of the website, and then you'll be able to find it there. Speaking of which, Connie, where can people find out more about what you offer and how can they connect with you?

[SPEAKER 2]
[00:41:24-00:42:10]
Yeah, so you can follow me on Instagram or Facebook. It's 17handequinenutrition. And then my website is 17handequine.com. It's 17hand with no S because my mare was a 17hand horse. So 17handequine.com is how you can find me. I am giving a free virtual... Webinar on October 28th about caring for senior horses in the wintertime. So you're welcome to listen to that and chime in. Or you can reach out to me for individual diet consults. I work with metabolic horses. Old horses, performance horses, miniature horses, big horses, all types. I work with multiple horses across herds as well. So I have barn programs available too.

[SPEAKER 1]
[00:42:10-00:42:26]
Awesome. Awesome. We have our four rapid fire questions before I let you go. You've answered them already a few years ago. And whether your answer is the exact same or different, we'll find out. The first one is, do you have a motto or a favorite saying?

[SPEAKER 2]
[00:42:26-00:42:32]
I've changed this recently. I like this phrase I heard recently, which is slow doesn't mean false.

[SPEAKER 1]
[00:42:33-00:42:41]
That's very good and very true. The next one, who has been the most influential person in your equestrian journey?

[SPEAKER 2]
[00:42:41-00:42:43]
Daisy, my mare. Yep.

[SPEAKER 1]
[00:42:44-00:42:52]
I think that was the same answer. It still is. I love that so much. I love it. If you could give a questioner one piece of advice, what would it be?

[SPEAKER 2]
[00:42:53-00:42:55]
Sorry, I'm ruminating on this one a little bit.

[SPEAKER 1]
[00:42:55-00:42:55]
That's okay.

[SPEAKER 2]
[00:42:55-00:43:23]
There's so many different pieces of advice I would give, but I would say that I think the number one piece of advice is learn from many mentors. Be really curious and never stop learning because there's so much to learn. There's so many different places. And if you're stuck into one mindset or if you're following one specific person, you may be blinded to other things that are around you. So choose many mentors in your equestrian journey.

[SPEAKER 1]
[00:43:23-00:43:31]
I love that. It's a really good one. The last one, please complete this sentence for me. Horses are...

[SPEAKER 4]
[00:43:32-00:43:33]
A way to find freedom.

[SPEAKER 1]
[00:43:35-00:43:55]
Oh, that's so nice. Connie, thank you so much for being with us here today. I loved speaking with you again. Like I said, it's been a couple of years since we've connected like this. And so it was so nice to have you back on. Like I said, I am taking a lot from this personally. I'm sure those listening will as well. So thank you so much for being with us today.

[SPEAKER 4]
[00:43:55-00:43:56]
Thank you for having me.

[SPEAKER 1]
[00:43:58-00:44:32]
Thank you for listening to this episode of the Equestrian Connection podcast by WeHorse. If you enjoyed this episode, it would mean the world to us if you could leave us a rating and review, as well as share us on social media. You can find us on Instagram at WeHorse underscore USA and check out our free seven day trial on WeHorse.com where you can access over 175 courses with top trainers from around the world in a variety of topics and disciplines. Until next time, be kind to yourself, your horses, and others.